Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

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Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:09 am

This is something that I think is of importance to all internet users in Australia.

There has already been much controversy and discussion (not necessarily here) about Stephen Conroy's proposed internet filter, and just how damn stupid an idea that it is.

There appears to be some movement towards having a national day of protest against the filter on March 6, and I think it's of such import that it needs to be supported by as many people as possible, and the proposed filter needs to be disposed of as a concept. OK, y'all know my view. :)

For those of us who may be attending, I'm thinking that we could all get together within our respective cities and attend in groups, protesting and taking photos too. The proposal is that these will be family friendly events ...

As I become aware of more details, I shall post them here. Please feel free to discuss the filter - pros and cons - and the protest, within this thread.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Reschsmooth on Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:29 am

Let me get this right, Mr Stark: You are vehemently opposed to a government body determining that a dentist's website is of such danger to our children that it must be blocked to all Australians at the ISP level? Forsooth, man, where is the trust in our elected governing officials? Why can't a parent have the right to delegate their parenting responsibilities, and therefore blame, to a third party, yet, at the same time, cry "think of the children"? :biglaugh:

And I bet you think that a male photographing children at the beach is not a paedophile! :D
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:06 am

Reschsmooth wrote: trust in our elected governing officials?


:biglaugh:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby aim54x on Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:18 am

A filter....now this is something that I would be against, it has too much scope for abuse...is australia turning into a country where freedom of information is likely to be restricted?
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Ant on Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:27 am

Even better a filter controlled by a secret list managed by a "trusted" authority delegated by the government. No chance of abuse or incompetence there. I will definitely be interested in attending any protest against this.

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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Reschsmooth on Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:27 am

aim54x wrote:A filter....now this is something that I would be against, it has too much scope for abuse...is australia turning into a country where freedom of information is likely to be restricted?


What do you mean, Cameron? You have and will continue to have free access to all [approved] information. :D Seriously, many of our 'freedoms' have been curtailed over years anyway.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby aim54x on Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:18 am

Reschsmooth wrote:
aim54x wrote:A filter....now this is something that I would be against, it has too much scope for abuse...is australia turning into a country where freedom of information is likely to be restricted?


What do you mean, Cameron? You have and will continue to have free access to all [approved] information. :D Seriously, many of our 'freedoms' have been curtailed over years anyway.


Damn....free [approved] access....yes many of our freedoms have been curtailed....maybe our future is looking very 1984.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby biggerry on Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:32 am

hmm, good time to invest in a VPN company shares... :up:

At the end of the day do we really expect the internet will remain so 'open''? It will eventually be curtailed inline with censorship requirements of specific countries, just like traditional mediums of content delivery are currently censored and filtered, for example movies, games etc.

Whilst I do not agree with the concept of the ISP filter, i do believe there does need to be internet content management in certian context and age groups - how this could be implemented is another ball game and quite possibly, impossible without a global (not in teh world sense) restriction. The ease at which access to certian content is a little scary, for example, if I was a 14 yro kid with my shiny new phone I know the first place I would be visiting :wink: I think this is an issue. In any case I don't think the filter is going to stop your average 14yo kid from looking at stuff he should not anyway :roll:

I do look forward to reading this discussion, I think it is more than just a 'restriction on our freedom' issue. I always liek a good debate where there is more than 'kicking the tyres', what are the alternatives are there? what should teh government be doing?

Why can't a parent have the right to delegate their parenting responsibilities


quite frankly, some should not. :rotfl2:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:31 pm

biggerry wrote:what should teh government be doing?



Not a damn thing! It's none of their business.

Otherwise, they should just take over parenting everyone's kids too, and doing everything for us.

Who would like some unknown public servant telling them how to bring up their children? Do you think they could do a better job than you? Look at just how ineffectual our public agencies are, for a great example of just how well this will be implemented.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby biggerry on Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:36 pm

Not a damn thing! It's none of their business.


one could argue that applies to Films, games etc...
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:53 pm

biggerry wrote:
Not a damn thing! It's none of their business.


one could argue that applies to Films, games etc...


I agree. I find censorship of any kind to be totally offensive
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby dawesy on Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:43 pm

I'd be interested in such an event. I have plans for that day, but could be moved or might not clash depending on times.

Arguments about censorship aside, the method by which the Australian government has chosen to implement a filtering system will have absolutely no positive effect on stopping criminals spreading material such as sexual images of under age children - none. It will have no positive effect on stopping children looking up porn or bomb recipes - none.

However it has already clearly been shown that it will almost certainly have a negative impact on business and other legitimate websites that get blocked 'accidentally'. It has already been shown that it will almost certainly result in censorship as legal to view sites such as those contributing to the debate on euthanasia or abortion get blocked.

How anyone can support it is beyond me. Even if you do support the idea of a filtered internet, this is patently the wrong way to do it.

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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby surenj on Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:57 pm

This is a bit of gray area indeed. It doesn't have an easy solution. This may be one of the solutions that have come up in their discussions.

But, I don't like the prescriptive approach taken by the government and would be opposing. [Also we get to take some photos as a bonus] Also by opposing, they will need to consider other approaches to the problem. [They are paid (tax free) to do this stuff so shouldn't mind :mrgreen: ]

See you there.... :mrgreen:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Raskill on Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:08 pm

gstark wrote:I agree. I find censorship of any kind to be totally offensive


Really?

Lack of censorship assists in creating a market for whatever it may be. If you allowed child porn (to use a extreme example) to be sold in newsagent next to 'Camera' magazine, it helps create a market. This market needs to be fed with images. These images come from somewhere, might not be Australian kids, because there are laws against it, but in other countries where these images can be obtained it more easily, it results in a market in child abuse.

You could also argue that the restrictions upon cigarette advertising is a form censorship. Surely you can see the benefits of that?

However, I fail to see the reason for the internet filter. I also fail to see the need for the secrecy. Open and honest government is a must, but we're all adults and we know how likely that is.

I'm sure that those folks who wish to look at kiddie porn (to use that as an example) will continue to be share images. Which means the government is spending our money on a useless system designed to get them votes... surely not!

Personally, I don't see some Machiavellian government policy, it's just the government looking for votes from those who believe the internet is the devils spawn. Ironically, there are more of us who wont vote for them because of it. Unfortunately, more people will just not care...
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Killakoala on Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:17 pm

Although the filter is designed to prevent access to websites and content that are 'Refused Classification,' (Child porn is illegal rather than refused classification) I don't trust this or any future government to maintain the filter in the manner to which it is intended. Being able to add to the list without consultation or public enquiry is unacceptable in a democratic country, even ours.

Surely we, as adults and parents, should be able to censor our own lives and not require a third party to do it for us.

The previous government supplied firewalls free to any parent who wanted to install it on their home computers. However the uptake was minimal. I would imagine that was either because the parents were unaware of it or were unable to understand how to apply it (or just didn't care.)

Perhaps ownership of a computer in a home where there are likely to be children should be regulated with a license endorsement to display an adequate level of competence-of-use such as we have to allow people to use motor vehicles.

I will be marching in protest (with my camera.) (Unless the government requires me to be somewhere else that day :) )

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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:22 pm

Raskill wrote:
gstark wrote:I agree. I find censorship of any kind to be totally offensive


Really?


Yes.

And ineffective.

Lack of censorship assists in creating a market for whatever it may be.


No. The market exists regardless of the existence of censorship. Kiddieporn is illegal, but there is still a market, and it still exists despite it being censored.

You could also argue that the restrictions upon cigarette advertising is a form censorship. Surely you can see the benefits of that?


No. No benefits at all. Let's get real on this one, Alan. Were the cigarette manufacturers to come up with their product as a brand new product today, it would not get to market because of its health implications. There are two reasons why tobacco products are legal. The first is because our so-called governments are addicted to the taxes they can collect from these products, and second, because it's impossible to ban the products anyway.

And they're not, in all honesty, doing a good job on the drugs war either.

But getting back to the point, tobacco products are legal, and I'm arguably a semi-intelligent person, somewhat capable of making up my mind on any number of topics. The government has no place whatsoever in telling me how I should be ruining - er, running - my life, and quite frankly, they can go to hell! I do not need any half-brained (and I'm being kind) public servant telling me what I can or cannot do, thank you very much.

I accept that we need laws, but censorship, prohibition, etc, are not amongst them.

I am not in favour of a nanny state.

I'm sure that those folks who wish to look at kiddie porn (to use that as an example) will continue to be share images. Which means the government is spending our money on a useless system


Exactly.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:24 pm

Killakoala wrote:Surely we, as adults and parents, should be able to censor our own lives and not require a third party to do it for us.


Exactly.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby phillipb on Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:16 pm

The solution is simple my friends,
Let Microsoft develop the filter, that way the government will be seen to be doing something, the filter will never work properly and will be easily hacked anyway, Bill Gates makes a shit load more money and we go back to using the net the way we always have.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby sirhc55 on Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:48 pm

Oh, come on people. Steven Conroy is a GOD. We should bow down to his superior intellect and knowledge of the way the internet works. If we did not have these lovely people in our government we would all live in pure ignorance.

Who am I kidding? SC is a super wanker of the most vile type and should be censored by deportation :up:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby biggerry on Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:15 pm

Perhaps ownership of a computer in a home where there are likely to be children should be regulated with a license endorsement to display an adequate level of competence-of-use such as we have to allow people to use motor vehicles


I think that should be extended to parenting :rotfl2: - ya don't need any qualifications to pop a few kids out - quite frankly you should.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby phillipb on Fri Jan 08, 2010 9:58 pm

biggerry wrote:
Perhaps ownership of a computer in a home where there are likely to be children should be regulated with a license endorsement to display an adequate level of competence-of-use such as we have to allow people to use motor vehicles


I think that should be extended to parenting :rotfl2: - ya don't need any qualifications to pop a few kids out - quite frankly you should.


Yep, I agree, I reckon you need at least 5 years of practicing a minimum of 5 times a week before you actually have a kid. :lol:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby biggerry on Fri Jan 08, 2010 10:33 pm

Yep, I agree, I reckon you need at least 5 years of practicing a minimum of 5 times a week before you actually have a kid.


and if people did, they would realise the errors of their ways and not have children :rotfl2: :rotfl2:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby the foto fanatic on Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:04 pm

I think that the issue is that the government wants to be seen to be doing something that will placate all of those Family First voters that wouldn't know their arse from their elbow when it comes to technology.

They think that it is down to the government to stop their child from accessing porn online,when the reality is that only parental supervision can stop that.

Furthermore, the kiddie fiddlers and other really bad internet abusers are unlikely to be caught this way in any case.

It's the old predicament - sledgehammer v walnut.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Chaase on Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:33 pm

KRudd is doing more to destroy this Country than all his predecessors combined.
1/ ETS
2/ Post GFC Debit
3/ Fuel Watch = Multi million dollar failure
4/ Grocery Watch = Multi million dollar failure
5/ Boat People/ asylum explosion
6/ Lets not forget the million dollar failure of the "Ideas Summit" Anyone know of one idea raised that has been implemented?
7/ Laptops for schools, hmmm where??
8/ Government travel expenses including a whopping $1,429,707 for the delegation to travel to Copenhagen.
9/ Now Internet Censorship.

Welcome Comrades to the new Australia. Abbott just needs to high lite the waste of Keven 747 plus the cost implications (tax) of the ETS and he will be a shoe in. Lets not forget Comrade Gillard refusing to attend the remembrance ceremony, how un-Australian was that?

But will Abbott be able to get his argument across? any criticism made will be blocked by the internet censors as it will be against the Nations Interest LOL. Mind you do we want governance by the Doctrine of the Catholic church? When is the next boat leaving this once great land?
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Killakoala on Tue Jan 12, 2010 4:26 pm

Chaase wrote: [SNIP] Mind you do we want governance by the Doctrine of the Catholic church? When is the next boat leaving this once great land?


But where will people like you an I go?
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Chaase on Tue Jan 12, 2010 4:54 pm

Killakoala wrote:[
But where will people like you an I go?


No, I would prefer to stay and fight!
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Chaase on Thu Jan 14, 2010 3:45 pm

China blocks web content it deems politically objectionable in a vast censorship system dubbed the "Great Firewall of China''.

Google said it was targeted by China-based cyber spies along with at least 20 other unidentified firms in an apparent bid to hack into the email accounts of rights activists around the world.


http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/google ... 5819258860

Several people, some bearing flowers, turned up yesterday at Google's China headquarters in Beijing to show their support for the internet giant, an AFP journalist witnessed.

"We are ordinary Google users who have come here to say thank you. We want to show our support to Google,'' said one woman, who would not give her name.

Yesterday, searches on "illegal flowers'' were reportedly added to China's online censorship list to bar results regarding bouquets being left at Google's offices in that country.


This is what we are potentially in for.

For those that have not seen it check out http://stephen-conroy.com/
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Thu Jan 14, 2010 4:08 pm

Chaase wrote:For those that have not seen it check out http://stephen-conroy.com/


For the information of those who might not be aware, that site is a satire site, and has nothing to with Stephen Conroy himself. Nothing that a comedy writer could come up with could be as funny as Conroy actually is.

Sadly, he is not really all that funny.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby glamy on Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:36 pm

I am no expert but their failures in the "Fuel Watch" and "Grocery Watch" web sites show how incompetent they are. This filter is bound to fail, the same with the High speed network. It is hard to see whom they are trying to please.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Killakoala on Mon Jan 18, 2010 9:11 pm

glamy wrote: --snip-- It is hard to see whom they are trying to please.


Dare I be the first to say 'Family First' and Senator Steve Fielding.

http://www.arnnet.com.au/article/325310 ... _filtering
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Guess this will be Conroys next target

Postby Chaase on Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:14 am

<snip>
CHINA has started scanning text messages in the latest move to step up censorship.

Last year, the Chinese Government pledged to suppress pornography on the internet and appears to have extended its campaign to mobile phones.

China Mobile, the world's biggest mobile phone company, said it was complying with demands from the police to report ''illegal'' text messages that included pornography, violence, fraud, suggestions of terrorism, instigations to crime and gambling. It said a mobile phone would be blocked if a message breached any of its filters. It has more than 508 million customers and its network handles 1.7 billion text messages a day.

<snip>

taken from http://www.smh.com.au/technology/chinese-censors-take-aim-at-texts-20100117-mee2.html

Bloody scary stuff
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby tommyg on Tue Jan 19, 2010 9:58 am

Hmm, I thought a topic like this would have lots of comments - but nothing here except a couple of red Xs

:rotfl2: :rotfl2: :rotfl2:
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Re: Guess this will be Conroys next target

Postby ATJ on Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:00 pm

Chaase wrote:...''illegal'' text messages that included pornography...

um... I guess I'm missing something here...
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Re: Guess this will be Conroys next target

Postby dawesy on Tue Jan 19, 2010 12:18 pm

ATJ wrote:um... I guess I'm missing something here...


They are talking about the Chinese government's definition of porn, so I'd suspect any perhaps the sort of explicit texts that might be sent between consenting adults who, say, are away from each other for a week or two might fall into that category.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Killakoala on Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:49 pm

Text Sex. Must be what the young people do these days :)
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby sirhc55 on Wed Jan 20, 2010 5:25 pm

Do any of you believe that our government is NOT scanning emails and phone text.

Let’s face it, governments come and go, but ASIO is omnipresent :roll:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby Chaase on Thu Jan 21, 2010 9:08 am

Killakoala wrote:Text Sex. Must be what the young people do these days :)


It's called "Sexting" here is a definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexting :shock:
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby ATJ on Thu Jan 21, 2010 9:31 am

Chaase wrote:
Killakoala wrote:Text Sex. Must be what the young people do these days :)


It's called "Sexting" here is a definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexting :shock:

It appears the definition of "text message" no longer includes just text messages, but now also includes MMS.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby gstark on Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:37 pm

Ok ...

The only actual protest that I can information on is happening tomorrow, March 6, in Melbourne.

I've heard talk of some other events happening in a month or so; as I hear more, I will let all y'all know.
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Re: Internet filter - national day of protest on March 6th

Postby stubbsy on Sat Mar 06, 2010 11:35 am

Gary

This link with details for other locales is at the link you gave. eg there's a protest in Sydney at 1pm today

http://openinternet.com.au/2010/03/03/saturday-march-6-national-day-of-action/
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