I'm all for aggressive marketing but...

[chrisk]

this just pisses me right off.

ECS News:
A somewhat disturbing piece of information from our camera technician the other day. Apparently, he reports, the nano crystal coating on the internal elements of Nikkor pro-grade lenses is 'extremely soft'. Bottom line, don't let your 'N' coat lens become effected by fungus or mould because any attempt to clean or remove will result is irreparable damage to the nano crystal coating. Time to finally make that purchase of a Wonderful Dry Cabinet you've been planning for months!

as some of you know, i'm a big fan of ECS. have bought alot of gear from there over the years but i gotta tell ya...when i read this i was shocked at the deceptive load of BULLSHIT these people spouted just for the sake of trying to scare people into buying a product they sell. this is cheap trick marketing i'd be more accustomed to seeing on some 2 bit online seller. not a well respected retailer.

i wonder what nikon think of one of their authorised dealers making such claims about their top end products ? another nail in the coffin for brick and mortar aussie sellers. not only do we get the luxury of paying them massively inflated prices but we get the privilege of them bullshitting us aswell.

[jaff]

Rooz, I am a bit confused by your post..... you need to get in touch with your sensitive side/feelings and not bottle up your emotions...........now how do you really feel!!
Could'nt agree more with your sentiments, it is now a global market and retailers can no longer take advantage of the fact they are the only(nearly)game in town and that for us, the unwashed, specialist knowledge is a mere key stroke away!

[gstark]

Chris,

While I have no knowledge of the truth (or otherwise) of the problem that they appear to be presenting, I agree completely with your sentiments here, and I reject entirely their feeble attempts to use FUD to try to enhance their marketing and sales.

This is the domain of the slimy used car salesman. Black mark to ECS.

[Reschsmooth]

I would share your pain, Chris, however, this is nothing new. In my industry (hoping to one day become a profession), I see a stack of articles in industry magazines highlighting a problem (that may or may not have existed) and the best solution. The author of the article happens to work for a company that provides said 'solution'.

In the end, I see this as nothing different than:

1. A photographer highlighting why happy snaps of the kids are doing the family a disservice and that they need a "portrait session" solution (which the photographer happens to sell).
2. A pro-lab highlighting the problem of uncalibrated monitors and the effect of printing photos on the home PC or at Big W, etc and why they should get their photos printed at....wait for it....a pro-lab.
3. The home appliance shop advertising the 'problem' with not storing your wine in a climate controlled environment, such as wine cabinet which.....they happen to sell.

All that said, if they are fabricating the truth to sell a product, that is unacceptable.

[aim54x]

that does sound a bit contrived...I do wonder what Nikon thinks?

If the NANO crystal coat is nano sized particles....how can the tech tell that is it soft??

[sirhc55]

In fact what ECS is saying is true, to an extent. The nanocrystal structure used on their lenses is not what you might think, it is in fact a soft sponge type structure that is also coarse. If agressive cleaning were applied it could, in fact, harm the structure.

I know that Gary hates the word assume, but I would assume (hazzard a guess) that one of their technicians applied to much pressure in the cleaning process and damaged the structure.

I must stop saying “in fact”

[jaff]

As my regionanal commanders so keen on telling me ,"assuming makes an ass out of me and you" I am not so sure as to what it means
but I try to never go there!

Cheers Rob

[chrisk]

In fact what ECS is saying is true, to an extent. The nanocrystal structure used on their lenses is not what you might think, it is in fact a soft sponge type structure that is also coarse. If agressive cleaning were applied it could, in fact, harm the structure.

I know that Gary hates the word assume, but I would assume (hazzard a guess) that one of their technicians applied to much pressure in the cleaning process and damaged the structure.

I must stop saying “in fact”

chris its the sheer laziness and half assed and disingenuous way it has been mentioned.

no facts here...just some casual conversation, <insert premise here> "somwhat disturbing info", with a technician showed that <insert half assed "fact" here" but make sure its not official> "apparently the coating is soft". dont let fungus get to it or its gonna cause <insert fear campaign here> "IRREPARABLE DAMAGE." and of course the good guys who only care about you present the solution, <insert product to sell here>.

[gstark]

I know that Gary hates the word assume,

I don't hate it, but I do try to avoid using it, as it often infers a non-existent expectation for something.

And BTW, Chris, perhaps you missed this little interlude ... from the bargains thread ...

One would have to assume that it includes one lens as this appears to be near the ebay price for said item

Followed by this, a few posts further on ...

It’s not an assumption Gary

but I would assume (hazzard a guess) that one of their technicians applied to much pressure in the cleaning process and damaged the structure.

Or a lens element. That would be where my thoughts are.

[big pix]

it appears, that ROOZ could be very Wrong....... have a look at the ECS web site under ECS news...... I am lead to beleive that the info comes from Nikon ...... http://www.cameras.net.au/......

[gstark]

it appears, that ROOZ could be very Wrong....... have a look at the ECS web site under ECS news...... I am lead to beleive that the info comes from Nikon ...... http://www.cameras.net.au/......

Bernie,

I'm puzzled ...

The link - as you've provided it - doesn't resolve. I suspect it's the elipses.

Looking at the ECS front page, there is a sidebar item - the one that you refer to under "ECS News" - but that contains the same text that Chris reported in his initial post on this subject, including FUD. In red, no less.

There is no indication at all (that I can see) that this information comes from Nikon, and the FUD message (as quoted by Chris) only refers to statements made by their technician.

Could you please clarify how you're led to believe that this info comes from Nikon?

[big pix]

Could you please clarify how you're led to believe that this info comes from Nikon?

....... I called ECS and asked...... they also said I could ring Nikon Australia, but would get the same information..... too busy to go any further

[chrisk]

they also said I could ring Nikon Australia, but would get the same information.

well i i did.

they advised there there is no issue whatsoever with the Nano coating, (not that i expected them to say any different). they advised that any specilaised coating on any lens from any manufacturer should only be cleaned by professionals, (not that i expected them to say any different), and incorrect fluids, abrasiveness of mistreatment could lead to product damage which would not be covered under any warranty. (not that i expected them to say any different.) there is no specific tehcnical notice, recall, service note or any other such reason for an owner of nikon nano coated glass to be alarmed or concerned, (not that i expected them to say any different.) . They have not seen a systematic issuewith the glass, nor have they been informed by HO that there is reason for alarm. (not that i expected them to say any different.) .

when i said that the people i bought my lens' off made the aforementioned claim, they said that using a dry cabinet is good practice and they would recommend it to anyone; however there is no additional reasons why people should be concenred with nikons nano coated glass if the proper care, maintenance and precautions are taken. (not that i expected them to say any different.)

and no, just to clarify, they didnt tell me to rush out and buy a cabinet to avoid irreparable damage. nor did they try and flog me a set of steak knives or a collapsable, fold under the bed ab-shaper.

it would appear however that the point of this thread is lost on you.

[gstark]

Could you please clarify how you're led to believe that this info comes from Nikon?

....... I called ECS and asked...... they also said I could ring Nikon Australia, but would get the same information..... too busy to go any further

Thanks, Bernie.

Given Chris's post and Nikon's statements to him, I'm wondering if a further call to ECS might be justified?

What I'm reading is that

(a) Nikon are saying nothing new, and that normal precautions, such as we're familiar with and have been using since the year dot, are the order of the day.

and

(b) ECS are suggesting that there's something new and different here, and although they've stated to you that Nikon will support their statements, this does not seem to be the case, based upon what Chris is saying.

Is anyone else a little foncused?

[sirhc55]

Assume - To take to be the case or to be true; accept without verification or proof

[Wink]

As my regionanal commanders so keen on telling me ,"assuming makes an ass out of me and you" I am not so sure as to what it means
but I try to never go there!

Cheers Rob

It would make more sense if it was told to you properly...
Never assume because it makes an ass out of u (you) and me.

[ATJ]

I prefer the Samuel L Jackson version (from "Long Kiss Goodnight")

You should never assume, otherwise you make an ass out of you and umption/

(and yes, it doesn't quite work which makes it funny).